*Rambling Post*

"CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever" (carsoffortlangley) 08/14/2020 at 15:29 • Filed to: None

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I am sad for my friends south of the 49 today. Well, just sad generally. Targa is very ill and is hospitalized. The vet was talking me through the options/costs and I signed away a decent chunk of change.

We think of her as our “fur baby” and, obviously I feel that I owe her the same standard of care that I would expect for myself, my wife or a child if we had one.

What really got me sad is, unfortunately money is a finite resource and the thought of having to skip certain treatments that would keep her more comfortable, healthy or happy to save money horrifies me.

S eeing this on one of the forms as an option (not the option I checked) really made me upset.

Fortunately, we have pet insurance, so that *SHOULD* cushion the blow, but I sense a fight on the horizon.

What really got me down is thinking of all the daily stories that must play out in the states with people having these thoughts about their kids, spouses or themselves. To think that, maybe you can’t afford that IV or that specific drug. Obviously you can’t agree to DNR your kid, but I know people do die because they or their loved ones can’t afford coverage.

Combined with reading !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! on the situation he’s experiencing and the continual news on COVID, the USPS and other things in the US....I am just grateful to live in Canada.

I may feel at times like I’d prefer to live in the US (cheap gas, cheap living, guns are fun, etc). I can’t imagine what it is like to feel like there is nobody who has your back...even if our government systems are not perfect, it is good to have a safety net.

Darkbrador > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:36

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You are a good man. No money is ever wasted on a dog.

Ash78, voting early and often > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:36

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Trust me, I know. Just a month ago my daughter was showing signs of anaphylactic shock after an ant bite . I would have called 911 immediately, but I decided to wait 10-15 minutes to see if it would settle down.. .because of the impending costs. It didn’t get better.

The bills are at $4,000 and rising for a short ambulance ride and 3 hours in a pediatric ER. I have “good insurance” through a very large company...but like most good insurance, you have to meet a deductible before it pays anything meaningful.

America in a theoretical nutshell is “very few safety nets, but lots of upward mobility.” In other words, we as a society trade fewer services for lower taxes. Many people benefit. Society as a whole is better off from a purely utilitarian viewpoint. But what about the weakest/oldest/poorest among us? Are we willing to let them suffer in exchange for capitalist —even utilitarian — ideals?

No easy answer...but I think our systems are going to look a lot more like yours soon.

gettingoldercarguy > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:37

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We’re really experiencing the cost of not having a public option for healthcare.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:37

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You can call me an asshole, but every household should have a ful l discussion on the “limit” of pet expenses weighted against expected success of the treatment and remaining life span... and quality of life.

Darkbrador > Ash78, voting early and often 08/14/2020 at 15:38

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Children are terrible pets. And way more expensive to maintain, too ... 

mazda616 > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:39

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I wish I lived in Canada. I visited there once after being fascinated with the country for years. It was great. I miss it.

My daughter was just born via a scheduled c-section seven weeks ago. Insurance is still “processing” the  total we’ll owe, but the initial charges amounted to around $21,000. We will likely owe around 10 grand.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Ash78, voting early and often 08/14/2020 at 15:40

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Thats fucking insane. Full disclosure, you do have to pay for the ambulance here. It may be “universal heal thcare” but it leaves a surprising amount uncovered.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 15:44

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FUUUUCK (also congrats, what a mixed bag)

jminer > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:44

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I am very sorry for your doggo - this is always a heartbreaking time. In the last few years we’ve had to finally put to sleep a couple old or sick critters and it’s heartbreaking.

What you’re saying is very true about our healthcare down here, even if you have good insurance it’s a problem. Right now I’m fighting with our insurance company to try to get them to pay for one of my wife’s prescriptions but that’s a minor example.

I have a friend who their child had a major health problem and ended up needing surgery and a long term hospital stay and the bills ended up being nearly half a million dollars with decent insurance which is mind-boggling.

There is no way they can pay this or should have to, our healthcare system is very broken down here especially since the care we get isn’t actually very good on top of it.

*This ends my healthcare rant* I really hope your doggo comes through okay.

Roadkilled > Ash78, voting early and often 08/14/2020 at 15:45

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The problem is that we in the U.S. have created a society with less upward mobility than most other developed nations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_mobility

The political trick is to dangle hope in front of the voters. Tell them that if they ever get rich, they won’t have to pay for the safety net for the rest of society. Treat it like a lottery and tout the few who do get rich while ignoring the millions stuck at the bottom.

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:46

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I have had some issues come up with dogs and I always try to fix the issue if it’s reasonable and won’t just make the dogs life miserable. I’ve ne ver bought pet insurance, we just save up in case. My wife has looked at all the numbers from things we have had happen and it is better to just save up. Well at least Canada has national health insurance, I’m set to lose mine after November if this keeps up, yay USA.

E90M3 > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:47

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I’m sorry to hear that. My parents lost our labradoodle of 14 years this April, it’s never easy. 

CompactLuxuryFan > Ash78, voting early and often 08/14/2020 at 15:48

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If there is “ lots of upward mobility” in the US, it’s definitely not because of lower taxes. Safety nets enable upward mobility. 

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 15:50

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Awwwww man, why does everyone have bummer news today?! Hope the doggo gets better!

Honestly, I’d be loosing my mind if I lived South, it’s just a bad situation down there. This is total shit show of an election year for them and I think between that and Covid has all the players stirring the pot for worse .

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 08/14/2020 at 15:56

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Maybe. I have always been of the attitude that if you cannot afford to commit fully to something, don’t do it.

We have insurance, so hypothetically, we are not even close to that kind of thinking

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > E90M3 08/14/2020 at 15:57

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Yah it's tough. She's 1 and a half, and I think she'll pull through. But sad nonetheless

fintail > Roadkilled 08/14/2020 at 15:58

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The upward mobility ideal as a societal standard died off a generation or so ago, more boomer fun that isn’t for reals in today’s world, like affordable housing, education, and healthcare. Now many “socialist” (per the so-called right) nations have superior economic mobility compared to the US, and I won’t even get into health, life expectancy, social issues, etc.   Trickle down fantasy is showing us what it is really all about.

fintail > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:01

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I can’t blame you - you pay more but get more . South of Zero Avenue, people pay less but get much less benefit for it .   Fingers crossed for Targa - the loss phase is one of a few reasons why I can’t get into having a pet. Too much heartbreak from friends and family when that time comes. And kids, lol no thanks. The old car is enough of a dependent.

I see Murkan tourists are now banned though September 21 (and I suspect this will be extended for the rest of 2020 and likely into 2021).

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > fintail 08/14/2020 at 16:05

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Yeah, Americans will likely not be welcome for a LONG time

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:07

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We went on a vacation and the neighbor was looking after the cats and she asked how much to spend if a vet visit was needed. One cat was $250 the other we said $500 or more... it put things in perspective.

I don’t know how much we have spent on our Husky but I bet it’s approaching $1,000 or more. He has had gi a rdia multiple times and needs heavy duty antibiotics to kick it, we can’t take him to the dog park anymore because of the nasty creek water that he tries to drink at the park, and hence the giardia .

Gosh I don’t know what I would do. I’d spend thousands like $ 2-3k without blinking but depending on the issue I’d need to think hard: cancer or a chronic disease that would result in him wasting away I don’t know what I’d do .

Ash78, voting early and often > CompactLuxuryFan 08/14/2020 at 16:08

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Yes and no. They can breed laziness and complacency on the lowest rungs of society , but they can also allow people to take entrepreneurial risks.

How many great business ideas were shelved because people couldn’t afford to lose a steady paycheck and health insurance?

Ultimately, I think most people want to work and provide, and make a difference in the world. It’s way beyond aspiring to be a “welfare queen.” Most people have too much pride and drive to seek that out (barring a mental illness or addiction).

Ash78, voting early and often > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:10

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Yeah, at the end of the day our costs (vs your direct costs plus extra taxes) might be a wash, but I compare it to paying for an unlimited data plan on your cell phone. You stop worrying and just use it.

I personally lean toward wanting to pay more for assurance that I won’t be surprised.

Ash78, voting early and often > Roadkilled 08/14/2020 at 16:16

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We created a system that promised upward mobility (and largely delivered for a while) but it’s been co-opted by the greedy over the past few decades to the point that the theory doesn’t matter anymore. People will offshore jobs and seek the lowest cost most of the time. The human side of business is disappearing. I miss the early Gen-X idealism that we could create a better system through ingenuity, but then our generation’s poster kids like Jeff Bezos start to value profits before employees and even customers. That is the nature of a public company, but for all his wisdom and willingness to play the long game, I’m surprised employee issues are still plaguing them.

E90M3 > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:16

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Any idea what’s wrong?

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:29

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I dropped $2 K (CDN) today, but that isn’t for treatment, just stabilization and tests

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > E90M3 08/14/2020 at 16:30

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She passed quite a bit of blood yesterday and we took her to the vet and she got some medication. Today, she couldn’t walk and seemed in pain so I took her to the hospital.

It’s a mystery to me

E90M3 > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:32

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Yikes, well hopefully she’ll pull through. 

Svend > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:33

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I sincerely hope Targa pulls through and all this can be remembered as a bad experience.

Here in the U.K. I’ve not been well for two months, leg infection, then told I’m likely to be or become Type 2 diabetic if I don’t get my weight down, got a persistent water/urine infection, trying hard to adjust to new diet being incredibly good and strong about it, after three weeks the water infection seemed to go but had down a number on my stomach and intestines, sent so many samples, been on different types of meds (a prescription is £9+ here in England if your in full time employment (Scotland. Wales and Northern Ireland it’s free, but they have much smaller populations), I can take a Pre Payment Certificate out which would cover all my prescriptions, (£25.60 for three months, £109+ for 12 months). I get SSP (statutory sick pay from the government which my employer can boost if I keep sending a doctor’s ‘sick note’ in). I was hospitalised for a short while. All that time, I never had to worry about money or my job, ambulances are free, air ambulances are free and either paid from the hospital in some areas, by the NHS trust in some areas, or like in many areas, funded by charity donations from the public or organisations.

We have a thing called ‘blood bike’s and ‘blood cars’, which tr ansport urgent blood and donor parts around the country either in their own cars or cars donated free by car dealerships or community funded through charity events. 

vondon302 > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:37

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So sorry about Targa. My favorite cat got stomach cancer and was given about a 60 percent survivability with treatment that would cost 5000 . I wanted to do it but the treatment would of been so hard for her and the pet won’t understand your trying to help. Plus I had just built my house and really didn't have the money. I just tried to make her comfortable. I still contribute to the human society in her name. Good luck and hang in there

Covid has exposed ho w weak and divided the US really is.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:45

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Those are tough decisions. We took our Molly to the vet on a one-way ticket and even that cost like $150. She was good puppers.

Textured Soy Protein > fintail 08/14/2020 at 16:50

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We don’t even really pay appreciably lower taxes than other countries. We’ve got federal, state, and sometimes local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, etc. We just have much lower return on our investment in the form of social services because one of the two parties in our 2-party system is a far- right cult that has no interest in the government governing in a way that benefits people. They want the government to “stay out of” things except when it comes to oppression. Can’t spend money on those pesky social programs that would actually improve people’s quality of life only help individuals they deem unworthy anyway.

wafflesnfalafel > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 16:54

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right - a significant percentage of US individual bankruptcies are tied to medical costs, (66%? )

Take it easy, shooting positive thoughts in your direction.

https://www.theonion.com/severely-injured-woman-heroically-fights-off-paramedics-1844671492

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > wafflesnfalafel 08/14/2020 at 16:55

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thanks

Mid Engine > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 17:02

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Hope your doggo gets better, that’s the main reason I don’t have a doggo currently. Just can’t deal with death.

Lotsa talk about the Canadian health system and the U.S., I’ve lived in both countries and for what it’s worth I much prefer the U.S. system. I do have excellent health insurance but that’s pretty standard in high tech, max out of pocket in a year is $5k. FSA covers $2500 too (pre-tax account for paying medical stuff). I want/need to see a doctor (including specialists) I can usually get an appointment same day. I pay 50% less inco me tax here.

The Canadian system is far from ideal; it’s run like a triage always. You can wait a long time to see a doc, and if you need to see a specialist you have to get a referral from a GP. In Montreal there are no GP’s taking patients, you have to go sit in a waiting room at a clinic. Pretty common to wait 4+ hours.
 

I waited almost two years for knee surgery, my son went to the emergency due to pretty extreme gastro issues, waited 21 hours to see a doc. Ya get what you pay for. 

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Mid Engine 08/14/2020 at 17:05

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“ In Montreal there are no GP’s taking patients, you have to go sit in a waiting room at a clinic. Pretty common to wait 4+ hours.”

Same in Vancouver.  Yeah, it is less than perfect.  

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 17:08

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We had our dog in the vet hospital for a couple days last year. Its a really really scary feeling. Hope things work out for you and Targa!

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 08/14/2020 at 17:08

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Thanks, did it all turn out ok for you?

Mid Engine > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 17:11

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So you pay unbelievable amount of taxes for “free” shitty health care. My daughter is a nurse in Montreal, plenty of stories that make your hair stand straight up. That’s one of the reasons I live in the U.S., the doctors and nurses treat you like a customer, because you are.

fintail > Textured Soy Protein 08/14/2020 at 17:29

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I’ve had to explain that to people when they moan about those in developed nations paying high taxes to fund single payer. When an American dares to examine their premiums and deductibles, then all of the services not covered, they aren’t any better off - with US per capita expenses being higher than similar nations, that says it. The additional taxes paid by people who don’t have the specter of medical bankruptcy hanging over them are less than the endless costs of the American system.

An unfortunately large segment of decaying society only cares about laws/regulations related to guns, abortions, and immigration, and for some, marriage. Everything else can be sorted out by a “free” market.

CB > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 17:45

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Agreed bud. I don’t insure Sammy because I’ve heard horror stories about pet insurance, but I’m glad to be Canadian and to have a job with great benefits.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > CB 08/14/2020 at 18:08

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I’ve had good experiences with Trupanion, Targa’s insurer. Hopefully that continues after this larger claim.

I just want her to come home today

avalonian > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 18:31

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DAMN, THATS A FUCK TON OF MONEY. For a birth? I am shook.

mazda616 > avalonian 08/14/2020 at 18:51

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That’s U.S. “healthcare” for ya.

mazda616 > avalonian 08/14/2020 at 18:52

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Also. My son will be 4 in February and his birth was via an emergency c-section. It was $28,000 and we owed $12,000.

avalonian > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 18:56

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I'm in Georgia, so I understand. But remind me to keep pulling out lolol. 

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 19:00

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My coworker had twins  that got all tangled up.

His hospital bill was $60,000...

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 19:02

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Did she get into something? That seems like an incredibly unusual condition.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 08/14/2020 at 19:06

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I think that she was probably fed something she shouldn’t have been while being babysat by my parents

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 19:08

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She might have some unknown allergy. If my dog eats peanut butter, she will get bad, sometimes bloody stools. Figured that out four years ago after scratching out heads... But “lots” of blood... that’s alarming

CB > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 19:35

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Sammy and I are hoping for the best.

At least, I think Sammy is. Unless she’s still focused on potatoes.

mazda616 > avalonian 08/14/2020 at 19:37

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Right. We had our two and we are done. Took measures to make sure of that. And what’s sad is that we both have what’s considered “good” health insurance.

P5guy now GTIguy > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 19:50

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Archie wishes Targa well. Good luck

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > P5guy now GTIguy 08/14/2020 at 20:01

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aw thanks!

DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/14/2020 at 21:28

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Yeah things worked out okay. It was a very weir d situation because we didn’t quite know what was wrong. Late last S eptember our dog (Daphne) got in to the garbage while we were out (something he had never done previously) and ate like half a package of old bacon we had thrown out. We induced vomiting with some hydrogen peroxide and took her to the vet the next day and had her checked out. T hey said she as good wrote her a script for som ething or other and sent us on our way.

Several weeks later Daphne couldn’t keep her food down and had blood in her stool, it didn’t clear up the next day so my wife too her to the vet where they diagnosed her with gastroenteritis and gave her an antibiotic to take orally. Well later that night my wife goes to give her the first dose and within 30 minutes Daphne was in so much pain that she co uldn’ t sit or stand comfortably. I got home and s he could barely walk over to greet me at the door. We tried to wait it out for a couple hours and see if the pain passed but it didn’t, so we take her to the emergency 24 hour vet.

They took a look at her, immediately recognized how much pain she was in and said they wanted to hang on to her, give her fentanyl, and take an xray to see if she had an obstruction. We went home got a little sleep and they called and told us there was no obstruction but looked inflamed. They said we could could come get her and hospitalize her at our primary vet if we wanted so they could take ultrasounds and monitor. We do that, they do the ultrasound the next day and basically they find out that her duodenum is dis tended and pushing on her pancreas.

So our vet was able to put together from personal experience that she likely had a E.Coli or salmonella flare up from the rancid bacon. T hey sent her home with some heavy duty antibiotics exactly for that and she was better in a about a day. She then developed pancreatitis about a month later...

Anyway shes still on special food, as she still has a really sensitive stomach. Sorry for the wall of text, just wanted to say I’ ve been there, it sucks when you just have issue after issue and the money keeps coming out of the bank haha 

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back 08/14/2020 at 21:35

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That sounds nearly identical to my situation

avalonian > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 22:02

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SHEESH, I don't know how some folks do it. Are all births like that? Cause if so? That's crazy

mazda616 > avalonian 08/14/2020 at 22:22

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If you’re not married and you don’t have health insurance, it all gets written off. If you are married and you do have health insurance, you get a big ass pile of  debt saddled onto you with that new bundle of joy. Kinda takes the joy out of it when they send you to medical collections before the kid even starts on solid foods.

avalonian > mazda616 08/14/2020 at 23:10

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Huh, so could you technically not admit anything, then have it for free? , just thinking out loud.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 08/17/2020 at 12:26

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So, so sorry to read this. Hope she pulls through...